Mattingly’s job to lose and he won’t lose it
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- October
- 25
Based on a few conversations this morning, the Yankees have yet to select their manager. Brian Cashman and his crew could bring their recommendation to the Tampa Trio this afternoon.
This is what we’re picking up:
Joe Girardi was fantastic in his interview. He was well-organized and was able to articulate exactly how he would go about his business. Everybody was impressed.
But Don Mattingly was able to distance himself from Joe Torre with some ideas of his own and expressed very clearly how much he wanted the job and the qualities he would bring to it. All were left believing he would be a good leader. The “I played for Billy Martin” stuff was gold.
Tony Pena has a lot of energy and people love him. The Yankees very much want him around. But it would be a stunning upset if he were selected.
My sense is that Mattingly was the favorite going in and would have had to botch up the interview to not get the job. He certainly did not. If anything, he improved his stock. That Hank Steinbrenner spoke glowingly about him yesterday should tell you something.
Remember, at heart the Tampa Trio are football guys. They look at baseball with a football mentality and they want a manager to be a great leader of men. George Steinbrenner literally coached football as a younger man and when Hank spoke on the conference call last week he couldn’t wait to mention Vince Lombardi and Bill Belichick.
This is why they will choose Mattingly. They will see him as a “true Yankee” and the person who can inspire the troops to get them beyond the first round of the playoffs.
It’s total nonsense, I think. Baseball is nothing like football. But that is how Steinbrenner has always thought and it seems clear that Hank feels the same way. Hal Steinbrenner, the rational one, will go with what his dad and brother think. He’s the business guy, Hank is the baseball guy.
Now it’s possible Cashman could come in that room and say, “Listen, we all love Donnie but we need Girardi.” But Cashman hasn’t lasted this long as the GM by not knowing his bosses.
Besides, can the Yankees really run Joe Torre and Don Mattingly out of town in the span of a week? Might as well take away Yogi Berra’s parking spot and paint over the monuments.
I’ll say this, I don’t think they can screw it up. Girardi or Mattingly would be a good choice. I think Mattingly would handle the fans/media/external pressure stuff better than Girardi but that is only my personal sense based on being around Don for two years.
There is no chance - none whatsoever - that Girardi or Mattingly would stay as bench coach. Why would the Yankees want that? You would be creating a huge problem for the manager. As soon as the team lost three in a row the speculation would start.
So that is my evaluation. Mattingly as manager with Pena or Larry Bowa as the bench coach.
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on Thursday, October 25th, 2007 at 11:52 am by Peter Abraham.
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every game in football is a must win, baseball isn’t like that. But whatever, bring in Mattingly. He is my guy
Pete,
Off topic question here that you might be able to answer in a mailbag eventually. Do you have any idea whether Gagne’s awful pitching will drop his status from a type-A to a type-B free agent? I would hate to see Boston offer him arbitration and then him leave and they get first round picks.
thanks
Jeez Pete, I was all ready to finally get off my hobby horse and you had to go and say the Yankees ran Torre out of town again.
Other than that, great stuff. Good for Donnie.
I look at this way Girardi is more of a football guy. He talked about his former alumni Northwestern where the Boss coached and Hank and Hal talked about in the interview. As, for Donnie bringing up the golden line “I played for Billy Martin” how many seasons or actually how many months did he play and learn from Billy Martin. Remember, Donnie played for Pinella, Buck, would have played for Torre if decided too come in 96′ and been a bench player. But, Girardi looks like a football player. And he could take hits like one behind the plate getting run over.
Peter -
Just a question. You say that pointing to Mattingly’s leadership skills, or the fact that they want a “leader of men,” is nonsense. Yet, when you praise Torre, you praise is mainly centered around his leadership qualities and ability to maintain calming stability in a difficult environment. That is what a “leader of men” does.
Am I mistaken, or does your support for Torre focus on the more tactical side of baseball, ala Girardi?
Also, am I mistaken, or did Girardi not mishandle a young pitching staff in Florida?
Thanks, enjoy reading here.
Agree with Pete’s assessment 100%. Would be great to keep both Pena and Bowa around. Pena as bench coach, and Bowa at third, if he’d keep doing it — have heard more than one commentator say he’s the best there is at that job (I’ll defer to the advice of others on that front). Love Joe G, but don’t see how they can give it to him over Donny Baseball if Don didn’t botch the interview - and in fact, did the opposite.
What about Pena as the bench coach? Give Mattingly a staff of:
Pena - Bench
Bowa - 3rd
Mazzone - Pitching
Eiland - Bullpen
And let Donnie choose a friend for the 1B job?
OFF TOPIC, this is the slowest loading website I visit. Out of all the sites I visit this is the longest. Is it just me or does Pete’s blog take a long time to load?
‘So that is my evaluation. Mattingly as manager with Pena or Larry Bowa as the bench coach.’
Sounds good, but isn’t Bowa leaving? Would you really want to take the best third base coach in baseball and put him on the bench? If you leave Bowa on 3rd and put Pena on the bench is that a snub to Bowa?
I don’t see how Mattingly won’t be picked as manager but if Joe Girardi was somehow picked I would be pleasantly surprised.
Disagree with you on one point though Peter, that Don would handle the external pressure, media, and fans better than Joe Girardi. Joe has the trifecta of experience in my opinion when it comes to coaching.
He has
-1 Year as New York Coach(Bench)
-1 Year as a Manager in the Bigs
-1 Year as a Broadcaster for the Yankees(Knows the media, knows how they operate)
I also think Girardi is a better X and O’s guy than Mattingly. They got rid of Torre because he was old school and you would think they’d go in the opposite direction because of that. Girardi would be that guy, gut feeling–Mattingly would not.
FWIW: Girardi was clearly better than Mattingly with the media on the audio call.
i have said it all along and i will say it again.
I think don mattingly would be a terrible manager. I hope you are wrong pete, i really do. I think Joe Girardi will be a mike scocia type while donnie is a deer in the headlights.
This is the easiest way to decide: Would Mattingly be hired by any other team as manager? No.
Girardi’s been offered jobs in the past, and will certainly be hired by someone.
That makes Girardi an easy choice.
If it’s Mattingly, I’d rather Pena as bench coach. Would be nice to have someone who as a catcher would have experience in working with pitchers. I heard Bowa say his choice would be Mattingly and he loved NY so he would likely stay on too.
Sounds about right.
I think Donny will surprize a lot of the doubters..
don mattingly would get NO other job managing while girardi would be hired within a week.
Peter;
I think that’s exactly right. Donnie it is. But I also think it’s possible they’ll try to sign Gerardi to some sort of consultant contract… just in case.
Also, laughed out loud at Hal as “the rational one.” Hank is, after all, “the pretty one,” right?
Agree with Pete’s analysis. I think Girardi SHOULD get the job but Mattingly WILL get the job.
If for no other reason than that Yankee brass won’t know what to do with Mattingly if he gets snubbed. To me that’s a short-term view. I hope they also have considered the long-term view of what to do with Donnie if he loses next year. I’m not saying or hoping he will, just saying they better have a contingency plan in case that happens.
How about pitching coach?
Any word on that?
Excellent take on this one Pete. How can you possibly watch Torre and Mattingly spurned in the same week, it’s just not gonna happen. They really could have saved themselves a lot of drama if they had just said they weren’t bringing Joe back and were handing the reigns over to Donnie. But, baseball, like life, is a process. I’m sure MLB procedure had a lot to do with the way this unfolded.
I do believe Giradi would be a great choice, but I just don’t see them not picking Mattingly.
“How about pitching coach?
Any word on that?”
99.9 % chance that it’s Dave Eiland. With all the young pitchers on our staff it would be crazy to go with somebody else.
I think X’s and O’s argument is overrated in baseball. By the time these guys get to the big leagues, the players know the X’s and O’s. A good manager surrounds himself with good coaches and let’s them do what they do best. A lot of managers say they go by instinct and a feel for the game. That’s what leaves them open to so much second guessing. The good ones guess right more than they guess wrong.
Global:
Girardi has a very rough relationship with the Florida media and obviously with the owner and the GM. Now he may have learned from that experience. But Mattingly has 18 seasons of being around the Yankees and New York. That counts for a lot.
Where will he land for next season? Bonds doesn’t know, but he doubts it’s with the New York Yankees as a designated hitter. A move to the American League as a DH would be the logical next step for Bonds, whose balky knees and age have contributed to him being a step slow in left field lately.
“I would consider DHing for the Yankees. Unfortunately, the Yankees have two DHs, so that dream would never happen,” Bonds said. “I’m out enjoying my life. I don’t know at this point what my plans are in the future.”
Fearless Prediction: It will be Girardi.
My problem with this is that I don’t want anyone that played with current players leading the team. I think there’s a conflict of interest and will they be able to separate my buddy from my player.
I want Joe G, but I will say this…the reason people love Donnie is that he is the constant over achiever…..small guy, not a lot of physical tools, drafted late, but is a hero in NY….maybe he can be an overachieve as manager too
Peter I believe it was Hal not Hank who bought up about Lombardi and Belichick.
If the Tampa trio is now determined to make business decisions (rtaher than baseball decisions as some have said) and also be willing to face “media” scorn, then I think it likely they would be unafraid to “run” Mattingly out of town.
ps - Slowest loading website ever.
What does it matter if either guy would be hired by another team? All 30 jobs are different.
Mattingly has qualities unique to the Yankees.
Don’t think too much, it can only hurt the team
Isn’t Bowa in Seattle now?
Why SHOULD Girardi get the job? When he was hired by FLA he had exactly the same experience at Donnie has now. Further, if you’re giving the job based on experience, Pena gets it hands down. If they can get Donnie with Pena as the bench coach, you get media savvy and tactician - it’s a great combination really.
And further, I can’t understand how folks are so down on Donnie. He was a leader by example for the Yankees in the 80’s (not his fault they didn’t have pitching). He was the leader by example for the Yankees in the 90’s (especially the impression he left on O’Neill, Jeter, Bernie, and Posada). Why shouldn’t he be the leader by example of the Yankees in the 00’s?
I agree with jonathan..
Yeah and Bowa was on the verge of Seattle what happened there?
I think Bowa is smartly waiting to see what happens in NY before he rushes off anywhere.
“I think X’s and O’s argument is overrated in baseball. By the time these guys get to the big leagues, the players know the X’s and O’s. A good manager surrounds himself with good coaches and let’s them do what they do best. A lot of managers say they go by instinct and a feel for the game. That’s what leaves them open to so much second guessing. The good ones guess right more than they guess wrong.”
Pat,
With that way of thinking Torre should of never been let go.
Agree, Disagree?
_If you leave Bowa on 3rd and put Pena on the bench is that a snub to Bowa?_
if he ws going to feel snubbed, he probably has felt it already in not getting an interview for the manager job…
Wait, who says Donnie doesn’t get a job elsewhere? He’s spent four years interning with the Yankees because he wanted to manage - not because he needed the money. If the Yankees didn’t want to give him that chance, another team would have hired for a coaching or minor league job based on his reputation alone (hard-working, likeable, media savvy). After a few years interning elsewhere, he would have been just as talked about.
It’s not like he’s coming out of retirement to manage. He’s been putting in his time - indeed, with more coaching experience than Girardi had when he got the FLA job.
Bowa has not accepted the job yet.
I love the, Don Mattingly can’t be a good X and O manager.
This brillant observation is based on what, exactly?
Also, he isn’t exactly replacing the best X and O manager in the game. Strategy was the weakest part of Joe Torre’s skills as a manager.
Pete is right. They can’t go wrong with either guy. Both are terrific and both will get the job done.
Agreed, saucy. And he’s still waiting to see if he has a job with the Yanks. And given the choice between 3B for the M’s or the Yanks, who chooses the M’s?
Peter thanks for your opinions.. I agree. I think all 3 guys could do the job.. Since they went down the road with mattingly this time to turn back would be hard to do……
IS the NL as bad as they looked last night????????
re: Bowa has not accepted the Seattle job yet.
As far as who would get hired at other places, and using it as a basis to judge one’s talent, Jim Leyland (whom many believe is the best manager in the game) has said on numerous occasions he couldn’t manage the Yankees. Its a job he doesn’t feel he can do because of all that goes into it.
Does that make Leyland a bad manager?
There is an old horse racing saying….There are horses for courses. Don Mattingly is certainly the right horse (if he is chosen) for the course (the Yankees).
Rob, I don’t disagree with your support of giving Donnie a shot. I haven’t been able to make up my mind over he and Girardi, but my gut tells me the Vets would respect Donnie more and follow his leadership.
But, as far as leading by example - that’s something a player does, not a manager. A manager can’t lead by example, they’re sitting on the bench……………….
Mattingly has a dark cloud hanging over him, and if/when he fails, the Yankees can’t fire him, causing an awkward situation. Yankees would be much better off with Girardi.
And for a billion dollar company that is a stupid way to make a decision. You choose the manager based on who you think will do better. NOT on can you get rid of two Yankees the same week.
“Besides, can the Yankees really run Joe Torre and Don Mattingly out of town in the span of a week?”
i think the answer is no, so i agree the choice will probably be mattingly. i wonder how much choice mattingly, if he is selected, will have over his coaching staff. you’d think mattingly would want guidry back as pitching coach because of their close relationship as a player and coaches. you’d think mattingly would want bowa as his third base coach just because he’ll be hard to replace because of how good he is . in the bullpen, he’d need someone who was on the same page as the pitching coach. it doesn’t actually matter a whole lot who the bullpen coach is as long as they support the manager and pitching coach. same with the first base coach. i’d definitely like to see pena back as either the bench coach , third base coach, or first base coach.
it’s not a just matter of political correctness either that someone who isn’t white is on the coaching staff. the team doesn’t have much color on it’s management team or coaching staff. the management and coaching staff should reflect the diversity of baseball and the city itself.
Besides, can the Yankees really run Joe Torre and Don Mattingly out of town in the span of a week?
Give it a rest Pete. You wear your agenda like a badge of honor.
“Mattingly has a dark cloud hanging over him, and if/when he fails, the Yankees can’t fire him, causing an awkward situation.”
This is just not true.
I have said this before, and I will say this again.
Mattingly felt like he wanted to keep playing after the 95 season, the yankees didnt want him back. Same thing happens to other iconic players in recent yankee history:
Bernie
David Cone
oh, yeah and Joe Torre.
Pete,
Donnie’s got 18 years experience having his ass kissed by the NY press. You think that will last if the team falls 5 back in April and he’s not challenging bad calls because “they won’t change anyway?”
I think he’s getting the job, but for all the wrong reasons.
I also think the smart play for Cash is to recommend Girardi so if things go bad next year w/ Mattingly he can try to keep his job by distancing himself from the move.
Very sound assessment, Peter. The most astute observation is the opinion that Donnie was the favorite (of at least George) going in and that he did nothing to change that opinion.
also agree that a combination of Mattingly/Girardi or Girardi/Mattingly would lead to be too much specualtion and result in unbearable pressure on the manager.
To me, the clincher was Hank Stein’s plea to the media for “patience….”. I doubt if he would have said that before naming either Pena or Girardi (who have managerial experience).
Chris -
I disagree on the example thing. If some players are showing up to put in extra work and Donnie is already there, what’s that say? The stories about him are always how he worked his butt off to be successful with the deck stacked against him. Pete says he’s been the same way as a coach. Why would that change as a manager? I do agree on the respect though. The vets have huge respect for Donnie because they saw him in his playing days. He would command that clubhouse in a very subtle way. It’s exactly what they need. Giradi is a better fit for a young team.
Red Sox Fan -
I don’t know why you think your opinion matters
but…
Everyone talks about Donnie failing.
1) I don’t see how he’d lose control of the clubhouse, not with his history, the veterans, or his approach.
2) The Yankee not making the post-season is going to have to do with how their young pitching performs more than anything else. If they hire Mazzone and/or Eiland, they’ll be very strong in coaching those kids. The only question is whether they perform.
3) No one talks about the inspiration Donnie can provide for winning. He’s still looking for his first ring (like Torre in 1996). It’s a great story if he gets it as manager.
If it is Mattingly - what do you think the terms of contract will be i.e. # of years and $$?
I think:
-3 years @ $2 million per year
Pete why do the guys at nomaas hate you so much? They have another post dedicated to you, lol.
Pete,
Isn’t it obvious? This new guard cares nothing about tact. If they did, they’d get a gag order for Hank.
You mean that it’s only been a week since Torre was insulted out of town? Oh, the horror! That indignant uproar was more like a whimper and it was mostly by the press. Many fans loved Joe, but knew it was time to turn the page.
I feel we need someone with lots of energy for the young kids. First choice: Girardi (who would be picked up by many teams in a New York minute), close second: Donnie, Bowa for bench coach. Pena for first base coach.
I promise this will be the last time I post this (as I have discussed it in many other threads)… Mattingly has served as acting manager a few times when Torre was suspended. In one game against Seattle in early May, Mattingly failed to go out and argue a terrible call by an umpire on an attempted stolen base by a Seattle player (out by two to three feet — ump said safe bu admitted after the game he was wrong– everyone else in the stadium knew the call was wrong immediately). The stolen base was very important as it was the eighth inning, two outs and a one-run game. The runner scored on a hit and the Yankees lost on a HR off of Mo in the ninth.
There are two basic excuses that Mattingly gave to the media for not going out to discuss the play with the umpire: (1) he did not want to “show up” Torre who was being slammed in the media for the Yankees poor start and his lack of fire, and (2) he did not believe that the call would be changed. Neither of these excuses make sense or justify a manager (even an acting manager) not challenging a call that could — and did — change the outcome of a game. Would he make managerial decisions next year with a goal of not casting Torre — a friend and mentor — in a bad light despite what it means to the team? Does he not understand that umpires do occassionally realize their mistakes or ask their fellow umps (all of whom likely knew the call was bad) for assistant? And even if they would not reconsider this type of call, isn’t there some value in showing your team that you are there for them and a hope that the umpires will be more careful (or even lean in your direction) on the next close call?
I hope Cash and the Steinbrenner boys discussed this with him… I suspect they didn’t.
I said it was a gut feeling not basing it on much obviously. If you read whole sentences and posts and not flip flopping all over the place you would have seen that little tidbit.
Can’t fire Don Mattingly? If he doesn’t get the job done, they will fire him. He knows it and they know it.
I doubt the Yankees are going to change 35 years of doing business for Don Mattingly.
Geez, some of you must only know Yankee history since 1996.
If they can fire Yogi Berra, they sure as hell can fire Don Mattingly, and they will if he doesn’t get the job done.
Is he the right guy for the job? Let’s be honest, its pretty impossible for any of us to know that since we weren’t in the room when he made his case to the group.
The last guy they hired was 100 games UNDER .500 as a manager. If the internet was in existence at that time, I am sure that would not have been a popular hire. It worked out.
Before decided this hire (whomever it may be) is bad, why not wait and see how it goes first?
Mattingly will get fired eventually. All managers do. Only exception are ones that are offerred BS one year deals with incentive options on things he usually achieves who are given a take it or leave it deal, have no management support and then are bad mouthed by the ownership. Sorry, just being honest.
I still think Mattingly can be convinced to take the bench coach job, although I agree it could be awkward.
Also, someone said that they don’t think the manager should be someone who has played with these players.
Both Girardi and Mattingly have played with some of these players. Girardi’s overlap is obvious. Mattingly played all or part of 1995 with Mo, Pettitte and Jeter… but he was a veteran and they were wet behind the ears… (Posada also entered one game in 1995, but he probably didn’t get within ten feet of Donnie.)
Global
Disagree. I think that description does fit Torre but it can also fit lots of other guys. I had no problem with Torre being let go, just how it was done. Sometimes a new voice is good.
When you listen to a former player commentate a game, they all guess along with the managers on bunt, steal, hit and run, pulling pitchers, etc… They hardly ever agree in the booth and they all know the X’s and O’s.
I think the hardest decision an AL manager needs to make is when to pull a pitcher. Lots of the other stuff is just something for fans and critics to debate after a game when they lose.
“Mattingly will make a terrible manager” ??? Based on what??? Because he isn’t as eloquent as Girardi? Deer in the Headlights? Were you even around during his playing days?
Jonathan, if you want to keep suckling on Torre’s teat forever thats onething but to knock Mattingly’s leadership skills is asinine
I had read a quote the other day from Bowa saying something like he had delayed his decision regarding Seattle for personal reasons and that he would like to stay in New York if possible. Translation: “I’m not accepting the Seattle job until I know who the next NY manager is going to be.”
I find it kind of funny that so many people are hard-core about their choice for manager. We haven’t even had someone hired yet and the climate on these blogs feels like the old Torre arguments all over again. The truth is, there are no guarantees about a new manager. You make what you think is the best choice for your club. Any of us that were old enough to live through the managerial merry-go-round of the 80’s can attest that there were choices made back then that were seen as “no-brainer” or _obvious_ choices. How did those work out? Conversely, most people (and I was one of them) thought the Torre hiring was a farce when it happened. 12 years of playoffs and 4 WS titles later, we were obviously proven “wrong” about that.
I read somebody say something yesterday that any fan that knew anything or was “informed” (something like that anyway) would pick Girardi. Great - another argument about who the “true, intelligent” fans are. Nothing but BS. Also that nobody on the blogs was saying their favorite was Mattingly. Well, duh - the way things have been on the blogs, who would want to say that and get slammed for their choice? Not to mention online blogs represent just one source of opinion. For the record, Mattingly _is_ my personal choice. But that doesn’t mean I don’t like Girardi. In my opinion, you can’t go wrong with any of these three candidates. They all have their strengths. I would like to see Donnie get the chance. But if it ends up being Joe G, I’ll be happy to see him chosen as well.
Brad:
“Also, am I mistaken, or did Girardi not mishandle a young pitching staff in Florida?”
Yes, you’re mistaken.
Sounds good to me Pete, make it happen. Now only four months to wait. *sigh*…
SJ44 — there may not have been an internet (at least not like now) when Torre was hired, but his hire was still very unpopular. Buck was a young manager who had brought the Yankees to the doorstep and they were casting him away for some old guy who had never shown any significant success in his managerial career with three different teams.
I said it before…
If the ‘baseball guys’ pick the manager, it will be Girardi
If the ‘football guys who think they are baseball guys pick the manager’ it will be Mattingly.
Not passing judgment on whether this is a good/bad decision.
It’s just what it is.
Let’s see what happens.
However…if this…
“The “I played for Billy Martinâ€? stuff was gold.”
..is true and is a deciding factor, I’m a little scared.
Just my opinion.
Well, those young FLA pitchers did throw many more innings in 2006 than they should have. And they suffered many injuries in 2007. Whoever allowed it, the usage wasn’t smart.
“The “I played for Billy Martin� stuff was gold.�
..is true and is a deciding factor, I’m a little scared.
Its better than the “I played for Don Baylor” stuff
as someone wrote the other day, Girardi should be manager, but Mattingly will be manager.
100% guarantee.
Mattingly will walk away if he is delegated to bench coach again, and I wouldn’t blame him.
Well, Jon, it’s already been reported that the “baseball” guys would make the decision, just like they signed off on the offer to Torre.
Chuck,
2 things…first to base a decision on who will be the manager on the fact Mattingly did’t argue one call is ridiculous…second if you think that the Umps give a rat’s ass about a manager’s opinion of their calls, you are stuck in the seventies when the likes of Billy and Earl used to intimidate them. Does not happen today, in fact these umps enjoy the attention and more often than not instigate the arguement.
Is not hiring a guy because you can’t fire him, the stupidest thing you’ve ever heard? Who comes up with this crap?
Yes slowest loading site ever.
True…better than the ‘I played for Stump Merrill’ stuff.
Boy Donnie had some real winners huh…
Dallas Green, Bucky Dent, Stump Merrill
What a disaster…
I guess if believe the comments your read in the papers.
Personally, based on the comments and actions of the last couple days…I’m not ready to take Hank Steinbrenner at his word just yet.
Once again the BS on Girardi SHOULD be the manager? And without justification?
Let’s see:
1) Mattingly has 4 years as a coach and 18 years with the Yankees; Girardi has 1 year as a coach and 1 year as a manager and 5 years with the Yankees.
2) Mattingly is universally beloved; Girardi is not.
3) Mattingly was the template for kind of player the Yanks wanted to be in the 90’s - it was Donnie Baseball’s team to Jeter, O’Neill, and Bernie; Girardi was never an example for any team he was on.
So Girardi managing one year for a young, small market team that overachieved somehow makes him an obvious choice for a veteran big market team?
Please.
“Mattingly has served as acting manager a few times when Torre was suspended. In one game against Seattle in early May, Mattingly failed to go out and argue a terrible call by an umpire on an attempted stolen base by a Seattle player (out by two to three feet—ump said safe bu admitted after the game he was wrong—everyone else in the stadium knew the call was wrong immediately). ”
so what are you saying, Chuck? Mattingly has no fire? He doesn’t care about his players? I recall the game also. if you didn’t see the slow motion replay, you wouldn’t have been able to teel whether the baserunner was out or safe either. do you think another umpire was gonna overturn the call???
It’s regular season game in a 162-game schedule. At the time the Yankees were still leading. In those circumstances, you “pick your poison.” Apparently, Donnie felt it was a “no-win” situation. I think he has more MLB in-game experience than either you and I, so….
Had it been a Post season Game, I’m sure Donnie would have been out there!
“Is not hiring a guy because you can’t fire him, the stupidest thing you’ve ever heard? Who comes up with this crap?”
Agreed. Any job that you can get hired for, you can get fired from. Mattingly (or ANY of the candidates) knows what they are walking into. If he should have a poor first year or two and gets fired, it’s not going to be a shock to him. Obviously Mattingly is cut from the mold of “better to have tried and failed than to not have tried at all”. He wants his shot - that doesn’t mean he thinks there’s any guarantee of doing well. I seriously doubt that the Steinbrenners, etc. think they couldn’t fire someone if it was warranted.
VOIII,
Unfortunately, Mattingly does not have a body of managerial work to base an opinion on. But he was the manager for that game and he made a very poor decision. It also backs up the belief that Mattingly is too laid back and gives no comfort that he can be a good in-game manager.
I certainly would not say that this incident should forever stop bar him from being a baseball manager — but when there are other equally-good (and I believe better) candidates available, it is a strong piece of evidence against him.
I also get a bad feeling about Mattingly on the Karma level — he was our best and most beloved player in a forgettable era of Yankee baseball. He left and we won four Championships. He came back as a coach and we are back to high-caliber mediocrity. Certainly not his fault, but I don’t tie him to the WINNING Yankee tradition.
In my opinion (and gut), either Girardi or Pena would be a far better choice. But I am not going to predict armageddon when Mattingly get the job… He may very well bring us back to the peak.
Ok Rob, I’ll buy that. There are things he can do by example in terms of work ethic and commitment and dedication. Definitely value in that which should rub off on players.
I don’t think there’s enough opportunity to lead by example to ONLY lead that way, but there’s definitely value in it. He needs other leadership qualities as well, more vocal ones, to motivate and get the most out of his players. But I think he’d have those skills and definitely has their support and I do get the feeling they’d play hard for him.
Joe T was their father figure, Donnie is their uncle or big bro…. Let’s hope it works out if that’s the decision.
And I think that’s the biggest difference I see in terms of respect between he and Girardi. Both of them have a couple guys on the team that they’ve played with or against (Girardi more-so). Donnie is a NY legend that those same guys played hard FOR even as teamates. Girardi has more guys he played with, but none played FOR him. I think they’d see him more as just a former teammate, friend, than big brother, uncle type. Meaning, they may have more resistance to taking orders from him than Donnie.
How much that would be a factor, we obviously have no clue. They’re all professionals, but I would think it’s at least a possibility that guys like Jeter, Posada, A-Rod, (who’ve had more successful careers), etc… could have some resistance to taking someone like Girardi barking orders. Also in part because he seems to be known as more of a hard-nosed militant type of manager.
LOL no ump would overturn?
check it out:
http://www.hardballtimes.com/images/uploads/Bloomquist_SB.JPG
How was Dallas Green a disaster? He was actually one of the better baseball minds during his time. A bit like Valentine…
Still think Mike Scoscia would be better than both Girardi or Mattingly… but he is not available.
Whether it is Mattingly or Girardi, does it really matter? You can bet that Cash and Steins will insulate the manager with as much talent as possible so to minimize any failure. Even if it is the exact same team (won’t be) the new manager just needs the team to play the first half like they did the second half of this year….he will be labeled a genius….
LathamJoe — I was AT THE GAME. The play was crystal clear from the stands (I sit on the left field line, and saw the play as the third base umpire might have seen it but 75 feet further away). Cano did not argue but he jumped up and down and made it clear that he knew the call was wrong (which I admit players do all the time when the call is right as well). Nevertheless, everyone I sat near was very confused about why no one came out of the dugout. It was NOT a bang-bang play. Slow motion was not necessary to make the correct call. The runner’s hands were two or three feet from the bag when he was tagged. The replays (in real time, not slow motion) confirmed what I saw and the reports that followed on TV and in the papers made it clear that it was one of the worst calls of the season AND the umpire knew it.
Mattingly should have been out there. Don’t give me “pick your poison.” This was not close.
“Dallas Green, Bucky Dent, Stump Merrill”
Add Buck Showalter and you basically have the names of people you would see on “Hee-Haw”.
‘Howdy Stump’
‘Hey Buck, Where’s Bucky?’
‘Fishin’ with that ol’ fool, Dallas!’
Anyone that says Mattingly would make a bad manager has been taking too much acid.
There is a reason the guy was a great player. It came from hard work. He’s a leader. He’s been around the game all his life.
He’ll be fine.
There’s no way you can judge who will or won’t make a good manager before he takes the field.
Girardi has track record as a manager, but before he managed the Marlins, he didn’t.
Pena has track record as a manager, but before he managed the Royals, he didn’t.
Mattingly has never managed but let’s see what he does before we pass judgment.
That is of course, if he gets the job.
Most of you are probably too young to remember but in 1995 the guy that was hired was universally reviled and met with disdain. It was assumed the Yanks made the worst choice ever and he’d be fired by May.
How did Torre work out?
VOIII:
Great point about the present day manager/ump situation.
One reason I never wanted Piniella to come back.
I like to remember Mattingly the player and just hate to see him subjected to the scrutiny that comes with being the manager, win or lose.
Finally, someone earlier called Mattingly an “overachiever”.
I find that label to be oh so lame. Overlooked? Perhaps.
A late bloomer? Perhaps.
But noone with a swing that sweet or a glove that smooth, is lacking in ability, as implied by the word “overachiever”.
Who could actually watch Donnie Baseball play and say he wouldn’t be able to manage????
This isn’t brain surgery.
He’ll be more than fine if they get him 3 more set up men that throw strikes.
Here’s my question to those who feel Mattingly “isn’t ready” to be the manager.
Who are we to judge whether he is ready or not?
The guy has been a student of the game for over 20 years and has learned under some of the most brilliant baseball or managerial minds in the last couple of generations: Billy Martin, Lou Piniella, Stick Michael, Buck Showalter, Joe Torre, and yes, Yogi Berra.
Do you not think he picked up a thing or two from these guys along the way?
Education is extremely important in any field. All Yankee fans wanted Hughes, Kennedy, Joba, and all the other young arms to follow Mo, Pettitte, and Clemens around during the season to absorb as much info as possible because it would help them develop as pitchers.
I’m sure Mattingly has done the same thing over the years with the aforementioned baseball minds. The guy’s name is Donnie Baseball - not Donnie Tow Truck Driver, Donnie Pizza Delivery Boy, or Donnie Garbage Man.
Mattingly is no dummy. The guy has been a manager in training for the last 4 years under Torre and knows all of his players well. As Pete has said, that should not be underestimated.
I have no doubt he will be a fine manager for this club.
How did Scoscia did this year in the playoffs??
He’s not a genuis when his pitching stinks.
Who do some of you people fixate on the dumbest things?
Mattingly did not argue that call against Seattle because that is not what bench coaches do, even if they are interim managers. You don’t go out there and pretend you’re the manager and throw a fit and get everybody to notice you. That is not how baseball works. The Yankees also were struggling at the time. Mattingly acting like that would send a message he was showing up Joe. Again, that is how baseball works.
Once he’s the manager, Mattingly will argue calls. Of course he will.
Beyond that, there is no reversing of such calls. Safe or out can’t be changed. Only fair or foul if another umpire had a better view.
Honestly, the guy has been in baseball all his life and you’re keying on one play in one game?
In that case, let’s hire that minor league manager who threw a fit. He would be great. Or O.J. Simpson, he seems unstable. Maybe Hulk Hogan is available.
Enough with such foolishness.
Chuck -
I was wondering when someone was going to bring up the “karma” issue — or the bad omen issue, or bad luck charm, or whatever it is people choose to call it.
It really is amazing to me it took this long.
Both will work out fine as manager. Lets get it over with and move on to the FA’s we need to sign…
Pete,
There is no arguing with such dummies.
Peter,
Take emotion and sentiment out of the equation. Who is the best man for the job Mattingly or Girardi? I think its a no brainer.
Dallas Green? The players hated him….hated him…..did not work out so well.
I have a feeling the Yankees may surprise some and go with Joe Girardi….that’s the smart move, IMO.
Come on Pete,
Now you are being unfair. We are not asking him to kick dirt and pull a Pinella out there. That would have been very stupid (and I doubt Donnie has that in him). BUT even as an interim manager, you go out there and discuss a truly awful call. How is it showing up Torre to dispute a call that was clearly wrong by the naked eye, at real time from 200 feet away?
Yes it is one game. It was a game that the Yankees were winning (and should have won) during a terrible part of their season. But to think that going out to discuss a poor call with an umpire will somehow show up the regular manager IS RIDICULOUS. Interim managers/bench coaches are forced to go onto the field to discuss/argue bad calls all the time. Not to make a scene — that would be showing up the manager — but to state their case and to protect the team.
Mattingly has been in baseball for many years and I appreciate what he did as a player and I am not saying he would be the worst manager in the world. But you and everyone else is just using fluff and generalities. I bring up a concrete example to judge him by and you are upset! Jeez…
And Doreen: The karma thing is obvious and has been mentioned and it is out there. Certainly not a logical reason to oppose him being manager. But when I bring up a concrete, recent example of Mattingly’s management of the team — an event that has been stuck in my head since I was at the game six months ago, Pete (and various posters) are all upset about it being only one game…
Ya, the Yanks will surprise us and do the right thing..they will hire Girardi!
important choices are difficult.
I wish Peter would stop with the hate..but I love him anyway.
“How was Dallas Green a disaster? He was actually one of the better baseball minds during his time. A bit like Valentine…”
With the Yankees…
56-65. Didn’t even last a whole year. Some might consider that a disaster.
Better baseball minds during his time? His all-time record is under .500.
I know he won a World Series and all, but as many posters on this blog can attest to, that doesn’t make you a good manager.
Just because you stumble your way to a World Series, or 4, doesn’t mean you are a great baseball mind.
karma? really? is this really a logical reason why not to hire someone. Because of Karma?
A) Karma doesnt exist
B) Karma didnt mean much when the yankees signed Boggs/Torre/Clemens and all of their world series rings.
Come on
Great, Chuck. You’re 75+ feet away, the umpire is 2-5 feet away and has 20+ years experience as a MLB umpire, But YOU got the call right!
I agree, after viewing on slow motion replay (I watched the Game on YES), the runner was out. But as I recall Cano’s tag was at knee level and at “real time speed” the runner appeared to have touched 2nd base with his hand (at least in the umpire’s view - as he was not in correct position).
My point about “pick your poison” was - not the closeness of the play at second - but whether the choice to argue the call would be wise - since no other umpire would likely overturn the call. As I said, I trust Mattingly has more in-game experience at these things than you or I. True???
Question for everyone. Yesterday Hank said that the team was in transition. Could he also be saying that for a barganing ploy in the A-rod situation? Maybe setting us up to think we will be without him this year. Therefore making it a transition year. Or maybe letting Boris know that we are willing to lose him if the price isnt right and accept a rebuilding year?
“karma? really? is this really a logical reason why not to hire someone. Because of Karma?”
My horoscope says that Joe G’s dad can kick Mattingly’s dad’s butt. I hope the decision makers are paying attention.
Pete I don’t think anyone is saying he should have gone out there picked up a base and thrown it. we are saying he should have at least gone out there and told him “look he was safe” and let it be. But go and tell him you know he blew the call. He wouldn’t have been stepping on anyones toes.
I disagree with Pete that this is a case of some people getting ‘fixated’ on the dumbest things. This was a valid point, and it highlights a concern that a few of us have about this supposed front runner. It is rather smugg to just dismiss this concern as foolishness.
This guy was at the game, so first hand account, but one of the few chances anyone had in 2007 to see how Mattingly would respond to a game impacting moment. Mattingly’s response,,, well nothing. He didn’t argue the call for his reasons stated. Fair enough. But, I think any manager hired should be a guy who fights for a right call regardless, knowing damn well it could be the difference in a game, or a Pitcher’s effectiveness, or for that matter in the standings, and is far less concerned about how he would be seen as showing up his manager–whatever the hell that means. What is he thinking,, about the game at hand, or about looking good in front of Torre?
Ultimately, maybe Donnie distinguished himself as well in these interviews as he did as a ballplayer and will win the brass over based on how he articulated his plans for leading this team. Whatever the case here, if he does get the nod, I hope to hell it wasn’t because the Yankees hired him based on perceived fan or press popularity but what he can do for the team as field boss. Period.
Mattingly, Girardi, or Pena will be a good choice I think. I’m kind of leaning towards Girardi though, I like the fact he’s a little tough. Unfortunately I don’t think he will get the job though, they seem to be set on Mattingly.
First of all, I think it’s a little crazy to insinuate that a mere “interim manager” really shouldn’t try all that hard to actually win a game, that they should sit on their butts and be a good little “interim manager” and not say anything if their team is getting robbed.
Furthermore, call *me* crazy, but saying it would be “showing up the manager” if Mattingly had indeed gone out there to argue what was clear to the entire world a *blown call*, is IN FACT more of an *indictment* of Torre than a defense of Mattingly!
That being said, I don’t fixate on that one play. I just think Mattingly (by his own words) isn’t ready to manager. And I think Pete likes to say things to piss off people.
AGREE 100% yankee21
I don’t think that the call during the Seattle game and Mattingly’s decision not to argue is a big deal at all. It was definitely a blown call, but arguing would not make the umpires change the call. It’s not like the NFL, Mattingly didn’t have a red flag to throw onto the field and make them review the play. The only calls that could possibly be reversed are home runs when deciding whether they are fair or foul. There are no conferences to review “out or safe.” It’s no indication of what type of manager that Donnie would be, none at all. Bench coaches and assistants practically never argue in any sport. That’s the manager or head coach’s job for the most part.
The Yankees can’t really go wrong with any of these guys. They all seen to have a vision for the team and they all respect what Joe has done with the team and will respect the players.
Whomever it is, they will need to wear an iron suit because next year’s team won’t be that good.
Don Mattingly once threatened to kick Mel Hall’s ass if he didn’t stop picking on Bernie Williams. But because he didn’t argue a call, people are worried about him?
Seriously, how does this stuff matter?
Baseball is full of assorted stupid unwritten rules. Hitters aren’t supposed to watch home runs, you’re not supposed to steal bases with a certain score, etc. One of them is that assistant coaches aren’t supposed to go after umpires.
I love that idea that if Mattingly had got thrown out a game or run out on field and said “hey, bad call” , he’d somehow be a better candidate for the job. If only he knew, he could have broken a chair over Gerry Davis’ head.
In the long run, he’ll get a better shake from that crew because he didn’t make a fool of himself that night. Davis knew he blew the call. You move on. It happens every night someplace.
It’s baseball, not wrestling. Watch the players the next time a manager argues a call. They stand there and talk to each other. They’re not inspired.
Wolf,
I think you are right about how ridiculous a comment it is that you don’t hire someone that you can’t fire. I am one of the believes however that Hal and Hank can’t fire someone because of how they ended it with Torre. If you don’t want him back, tell him, “hey thanks you were awesome for us but now we want to go in a different direction”. Or you could do the fearful thing and offer a renewal for 1 year and for less money and hope he turns it down. Does that make sense?
It’s true.. Im not sure how being firey and loud got all mixed in with being a good manager…
It worked for 1 year with Crazy Ozzie over with the White Sox.. Now look where all his yelling and screaming got him this year..
the white sox won because they had awesome pitching and a great bullpen, despite ozzie guillen
Chuck,
Pete just owned you on his last two posts and he’s spot on. It is what it is. Coaches do not argue calls, even if they are the interim manager for a day, that is, I guess, an unwritten rule.
Donnie Baseball knew what he was doing that day, believe it or not. You should apologize to all of us who have had to read you harp on this one play, in this one game back in May, for the last two days to come to your conclusion that Mattingly is not ready for the job. Just admit you were wrong and move on. Most of us will forget about it.
Also, way to cover yourself on one of your previous posts. You said Girardi and Pena are the better choices over Donnie, but Mattingly might lead us back to the top as well. Now you can point out if Donnie fails that you were right and if he doesn’t fail you can say you were right as well. Nice.
The Yanks are gonna get an upgrade with whichever guy they take. It will be interesting; however, if the baseball people recommend Girardi.
This team needs a Girardi. Sorry to disagree with yea, Pete. I think this team needs an emotion, but smart manager like a Bobby V or Girardi just to keep things uneasy and everyone focused.
Like most of you commenting on the merits of Mattingly as a manager based on his unwillingness to argue the call in the Seattle game, I too was perturbed that he didn’t go out to argue an obvious horrendous call. Until he demonstrates otherwise when he is a manager, that will stick in the back of mind, along with his reasons why he didn’t argue, regardless of whether he was one my all-time favorite Yankees. And for those of you who think it is useless to argue out/safe calls because they are never changed - there was a game at the end of 2005 between the Red Sox and Devil Rays at Fenway with Schilling pitching. I believe Tampa had a 3-1 lead in the seventh inning at the time (they did hang on to win this one). There was a groung ball wide of first that required Schilling to cover 1st while taking the flip from the 1st baseman. The runner was initially called safe, but after the blowhard argued vehemently, the call was overturned (which of course brought Piniella out of the dugout to argue and subsequently get tossed). This game stands out in my mind because I had never before seen a call reversed other than a disputed homerun call, and of course because Schilling was able to get his crybaby way, and that Piniella was involved. So you can never say its pointless to argue an out/safe call, and it can be done in a way that the manager, or interim manager, can get his point across without acting like a fool.
Getting pretty late in the day.. Wonder if were going to hear anything…
Pete:
First, the fact that Mattingly was willing to stand up to Mel Hall on behalf of a young Bernie Williams is absolutely something to consider.
However, although you are correct that assistant coaches do not argue calls, that is because there is a manager present to do that. Donnie WAS THE MANAGER THAT NIGHT and managers argue calls. You cannot seriously be saying that if a foul ball was mistakenly called a HR, a coach acting as manager when the manager is suspended (or kicked out of the game) should not argue a call. So yes, if he goes out and tells the ump - “Hey, Bad Call” — he would have made the right decision in the heat of the moment, BUT if he went out and kicked dirt and “broke a chair” over the umps head, he would have been wrong.
Players stand there and talk BECAUSE they have their manager to stick up for them. They don’t need to be involved (although they frequently are).
And I agree that according to the rules this play is not supposed to be reviewed or overturned. But safe/out calls have been reviewed or overturned when they are wrong. And I would wager that I could find an example or two fairly quickly…
Being a manager is often about making the correct decision in the heat of the moment while taking proper account of how it will effect the game and the team. My contention is not that Mattingly will be a bad manager but that his decision that day to stay in the dugout without talking to the ump was a terrible decision that should be considered with the rest of his resume.
I think we should also consider what Girardi did as manager and particularly what happened on the day he had the fight with the owner… he may have shown some poor judgment and the owner showed even poorer judgment, but we can judge him in the context of the full season he managed the Marlins. Unfortunately, Mattingly does not have a body of work for me to put this incident in context with.
I like all three candidates for manager, but I favor Girardi (and Pena is a close second, but he is even a longer shot) becaue he has shown his ability to be a manager and to handle the adversity that comes with. I have seen little from Mattingly since his return to the Yankees as a coach that makes me feel as confident — and the one event that stands out in my mind is a negative not a positive.
We will want the Yankees to win regardless of who gets the job.
Pete, just wondering why Buster Olney is predicting the Yankees will choose Girardi. Does he know something no one else does? Or is he just hazarding a guess and pretending we should respect it more than anyone else’s?
Heyman is also reporting Girardi might have a slight edge over Mattingly.
Don for Manager with Pena as 3rd base coach and Larry as bench coach.
Arguing calls is now a requirement for managing the Yankees? Some of you guys are ridiculous.
People seriously think the Girardi-Loria argument only happened because of what went on during the game?
Like Buster Olney has never been wrong before???
ND Yank, as is clear from the posts, it is not a cut and dry issue. And personally, I think Pete is wrong on many counts. Read his posts. Read my posts. I may only be a fan, but — to toot my own horn — I am a passionate and pretty knowledgable fan. I respect Pete but Mattingly was not a coach that day. He was the manager. He was the only one that could have and should have discussed that call with the umpires.
And stop being so patronizing. I am not covering myself. I have hired (and promoted) people in my professional life and when you have two or three deserving candidates for a job, you often have to make the decision on the small pieces of information you have, regardless of how incomplete that information is. One mistake should not disqualify a person from a job but it is a factor to be considered. I hope this issue was raised in the context of his interview. If it was raised and Mattingly effectively explained himself, that is admirable. If he said he didn’t argue because he didn’t want to “show up” a manager that was suspended and not present in the dugout, that is a terrible reason. He was the manager.
How can one say that its a valid point calling Mattingly out for not arguing???
That is the DUMBEST thing I’ve heard on this blog and thats saying something with the morons who called for A-Rod to be traded, Cano traded, and Wang moved to the bullpen.
I’m sure this team really wanted/needed Donnie to be out there arguing an obvious blown call and go against every unwritten rule in the book.
I can’t believe the morons here are still going on about it.
Chuck. You’re a moron.
People like Chuck need their heads examined.
They are the same ones who would be saying that Donnie Baseball shouldn’t be manager if he argued a call in a game where he was the interim manager.
No, Chuck’s right on. Mattingly should have bashed Davis over the head with a chair and threw bats and gloves on the field.
Definately manager material!
If the Steinbrenner’s want a manager with a football mentality, why don’t they hire Eric Mangeni…
can someone tell me if the Sox-Rox game tonight is at “8″ again or moe like 8:35?
It would be a shame to let a talent like Giardi go. Hiring Mattingly during what will end up being at least a partial rebuilding process is a big mistake.
No one outside of the Yankees organization sees Mattingly as managerial material right now. Hiring him because he drove in 140 runs 20 years ago is pretty dumb.
Guys like Girardi don’t come around that often.
Sweeney doesn’t think it will be Donnie.
I find it laughable that people are arguing the merits of Mattingly as a manager when he has never managed an MLB team in his life. That he is being considered for the most prestigious and scrutinized managerial position in all of organized sports is a mockery. I believe that the interview itself was offered just to throw a bone to the mindless masses, and that Cashman with the backing of his baseball people, will go with Girardi. Proposing that Mattingly gets this job is like saying that a good blogger (like Peter Abraham for instance) could be editor of the NY Times.
great example, Pete, on the Bernie memory. Fantastic really. That’s exactly why the the Yankee youngsters adored Mattingly. He played the game the right way and worked hard to make himself better. He’s exactly the kind guy I want as a manager.
Chuck should be the next Yankees manager!
With his insight he’s a natural.
He’s my kind of nut….. er… uh…. Guy!
Teflon Don - You make no point except name calling. Address the issues or you expose yourself as useless and ignorant.
I don’t usually like to lecture to stupid folks who can’t debate a point without resorting to name calling, but let me try to explain: Managers have in-game responsibilities. One of those is to make sure the game is called correctly and to challenge calls that are bad. They don’t need to challenge every call and should not challenge calls that are inconsequential. But the truly bad ones that have the potential of changing the outcome of the game should be challenged.
i am completely fine with joe torre leaving and i think that don mattingly should be hired as the new manager. who cares if he has not managed before, you have to start somewhere. why not somewhere you are familiar with? fran healy talks about the possibilities of the new managers in his most recent blog.
http://blogs.msg.com/gameon/2007/10/next-yankees-ma.html
Hey Jennifer, did Sweeney explain why he doesn’t think it’s Donnie? Is he on the radio? I’m not close to one right now. Thanks!
gargoyle,
I’m really upset that we might miss out on a managerial talent that was unable to work with an extremely bright GM, created controversy needlessly, and ruined at least one young pitcher’s career.
Olney, Sweeney, Heyman are just background noise. A week it was being reported that Torre was going to accept a one-year deal up until Levine delivered the shocking news. We’re going to have to hear it from the horse’s mouth. (isn’t it funny how all these horse references keep popping up since Hank’s been in the picture?)
I hate to be add more fuel to this fire. Its a pretty silly argument that mattingly wouldnt be a good manager because he didnt argue during a game BUT, correct me if im wrong, but didnt Don Zimmer argue a call once when torre was gone and the ump asked zimmer if he was on drugs and old man zimmer thought it was the biggest insult he has ever heard? Anyone, anyone?
Count me as favoring Don Mattingly for the managers job. All 3 candidates are terrific. But Don Mattingly has seen more of the circus tent Yankees than either Joe Girardi or Tony Pena. And if the Levinebrenners keep talking to the media, the Yankees are going to become a circus once again.
Mattingly was around for Howie Spira, Billy Martin and Mel Hall amoung coutless others. He had to stay focussed through the madness. Don Mattingly will be Torre-esque in shielding his players from the insanity and keeping them as focussed as possible. He has that cache that neither Girardi or Pena has.
The other 2 candidates only know the more organized Yankees and I’m not so sure they will know how to handle it when things get crazy.
Love the Donnie wanting to kick Mel Hall’s butt story, but isn’t that ancient history? Something tells me that Donnie’s a lot more mellow now and won’t be kicking anything now. Especially not dirt ala Sweet Lou.
I’m sorry I miss heard his opening remark ;( I guess it is what I wanted to hear him say.
Gave the same excuse how could you get rid of two Yankees the same week. To me it is a very stupid reason to choose a manager. YOu pick who you think will do better, not based on the fact that you can’t tell Donnie no.
B
How have the Marlins done since Girardi left? They were expected to contend and took a big step back after hiring a “players” manager. Girardi was an outsider in that organization from the beginning and the long knives were always out for him.
And Mattingly’s credentials are what? Oh yeah - he’s Donnie Baseball!!
I’v been leaning towards Girardi all this time. For the simple fact that he is a firey person and did well in florida. But with Mattingly on, that would probably mean that we get 2 managers in one. Meaning Donny and Pena.If that is right, I want to flip flop my vote and go with Mr. Baseball.
Hey Pete or anyone else, can you tell me what are the chances of pena being bench coach of Mattingly is hired?
OK. I changed my mind based on the idiots calling me names(although they clearly can’t read). Mattingly should be annointed manager of the Yankees. There should be a crowning ceremony with a red carpet and rose petals. It should be made clear that Donnie does not need to win the World Series — he doesn’t even need to win any games! Just sit in the dugout and defer to the umpires at all times.
Donnie was a great Yankee and I hope he will lead us to many World Series titles. I apologize for pointing out an actual incident where he failed to act appropriately in a managerial role.
Peace.
I just talked to Hal Steinbrenner. If Donnie is willing to go a Little League in Tampa and kick the crap out of an umpire to prove what a man he is, he’ll get the job.
Honestly, people, whether Mattingly argued with the umpire that day has as much to do with his getting the job as what he had for lunch today.
If you read Olney’s acrticle yesterday it was his opinion and who he would hire and nothing based off of inside info. He may have inside info today, but the article yesterday was about what he would do if he was running the Yanks.
To change the subject…
Yankees need to rebuild their bullpen in order to go further into Post Season.
Will they build from within with Veras, Ohlendorf, Ramirez, Sanchez, Beam, Britton, Cox?
How about a lefty relief pitcher? The free Agent list is thin with only JC Romero or Joe Kennedy among those under the age of 35.
What would it take to get Damaso Marte’ back in the Organization from Pittsburgh?
I can’t believe that nothing has leaked yet. Pete, are you hearing anything, or is your Mattingly post your hint to us?
“How have the Marlins done since Girardi left?”
Most of their young starting pitchers were injured this year. That’s why they did so poorly, not because Girardi left.
mike gonzalez is supposedly over his arm trouble and a FA I believe….
You’ve got a lot of nerve Latham Joe to want to talk baseball here. Next thing you’ll want to know is information about the 2 players the Yankees signed yesterday from the Israeli League. We’re all preoccupied with gossip. Real baseball talk?? What’s wrong with you!???
_In that case, let’s hire that minor league manager [Braves organization] who threw a fit. He would be great. Or O.J. Simpson, he seems unstable. Maybe Hulk Hogan is available._
Pete, “Bobby the Brain Heenan”:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Heenan#American_Wrestling_Association would look great n pinstripes.
Jonathan,
Anyone can go back and look at stats Games won or lost blah blah blah. Dallas Green’s Body of work was more than his managing record. He was a solid GM for the Cubs and turned that franchise in to a contender in the early 80s. Anyone who listened to him talk Baseball could tell you he had a great deal of knowledge to offer. He also inherited some really bad teams to make his record sub 500 and he did have a better record than Torre pre-Yankees…
Changing the subject. I hear rumors that Posada is going to be offered a 3 year 40 mil deal. I think we should re-rign Molina to catch and have Posada play first base. He seemed to struggle last year in throwing runners out, unlike the previous year. He doesnt block balls in the dirt that well or runners going home.
With putting him at first he would be fresher the entire season to keep his bat alive. And lastly it gives us time to find the next first baseman.
The suspense is killing me! This is like Election ‘2000 Florida.
Just pick one already!
On another topic, has anyone heard anything about Torre joining the Fox both next few days?
“1) Mattingly has 4 years as a coach and 18 years with the Yankees; Girardi has 1 year as a coach and 1 year as a manager and 5 years with the Yankees.
2) Mattingly is universally beloved; Girardi is not.
3) Mattingly was the template for kind of player the Yanks wanted to be in the 90’s – it was Donnie Baseball’s team to Jeter, O’Neill, and Bernie; Girardi was never an example for any team he was on.”
1) One year of managerial experience is worth far more than anything that Mattingly brings to the table.
2) Which would make it that much harder to fire Mattingly if he proves that he isn’t up to the job. A total lack of managerial experience coupled with the hard to fire problem is a terrible a combination.
3) Actually that’s patently false. The “template” of the kind of player that won four rings was a high ISO D. Mattingly’s career ISO was .051
Fox *booth
Give it a rest Chuck. If Donnie is the manager this year and there is an obvious bad call that he doesn’t argue, then you can bring that up.
Also, lame cheap shot at Pete about Bruce.
Chuck:
“You got a lotta nerve
To say you are my friend
When I was down
You just stood there grinning
You got a lotta nerve
To say you got a helping hand to lend
You just want to be on
The side that’s winning…”
Bob Dylan…
and as Michael Kay so appropriately said….
See ya!
Drive 4-5-
Oh c’mon, we’ve got all December to talk ’bout real baseball.
The election and inauguration comes first.
“The suspense is killing me! This is like Election ‘2000 Florida.”
This process will be far more democratic (small d).
S.o.S.27,
Molina doens’t hit enough to be an everyday player, even at a traditionally weak offensive position.
S.o.S. 27
Agree that Molina should be re-signed. I feel he is a better catcher defensively than Jorge. Jorge could play some 1b and DH against righties.
Dee-
you obviously picked the wrong week to give up cigarettes and coffee.
I know how it feels. I picked the wrong week to give up meth and hookers.
Anyone have *any* idea as to when an announcement will be made?
Anyone? Anyone?
Bueller?
Tampa has a chance to get this team back in order quickly if they announce tomorrow Don Mattingly. I wish Girardi could be at his side but if we can get Larry sitting there , that will work just fine. I think the focus has to be on getting Mo signed and Posada. If A-rod walks away lets get a decent glove and hitter at 3rd base…the early Torre era was about hitters,great pitching, and defense.. not slugging and weak pitching…
“Bruce Springsteen sucks.”
Jeez, dude, way to vitiate your excellent points about Mattingly and the Seattle incident.
The priorities are 1)A-Rod 2) Posada 3) Pettitte 4) Mariano. The first two are a must to compete next year.
Hey, it’s not fair to call Chuck names based ONE post about Bruce. (But wait… Chuck decided that Mattingly was a bad manager after failing to argue ONE call in ONE game). OK. Sorry Chuck, but on review, ONCE is enough to let people call you names.
_The suspense is killing me! This is like Election ‘2000 Florida_
Dee — LOL!
That’s why I won’t believe anything until all the votes are counted!! Or the official announcement made — I don’t want to go to sleep thinking it’s “A” when it’s really “B”.